ROUNDTABLE

How do you make sure creativity pays off in your marketing programs?

Bryan Finke: Our mission at Nike is to bring innovation and inspiration to every athlete in the world and creativity is incredibly important in delivering a return on investment. Innovation obviously is very connected to creativity and understanding insights, and then translating that into breakthrough communications and products that hopefully inspire people and lead them to better performance.

Lewis Goldstein: Creativity is paramount in our industry and for our consumers -- the young, 15-to-24 year olds. They're always looking for new things. They're looking for innovation. They're looking for communication about products from us that are interesting and add value and that aren't the same. Our ability to be creative really is key to whether we live or die.

We're continuously challenged at Snapple by Michael Sands, the head of our group -- is it an evolution or revolution? And if it's not a revolution, then in most cases it's because we haven't done a good enough job creatively. Whether it's a piece of point-of-sale, a new product, or whether it's advertising -- if we're not stretching the limits, our consumers will probably go to someone else.

Robin Blunt: One of the things we've done at MasterCard is migrate our promotional platform into our "Priceless" brand positioning. To truly impact consumers from an interest and engagement perspective, linking the brand equity of "Priceless" into our promotional efforts has been pivotal -- and our marketing mix research studies reveal that it is highly efffective.

So, integration is a key. That integration is driven not only by astute channel management, but also by creatively taking the brand essence and capturing that in every version of the channel marketing. That includes banks or merchants at the point of sale, or on Web sites.

Creativity plays a huge part in that because it is the essence of the consumer involvement from an awareness and attitudinal perspective. Do I engage with the brand? Does it mean something? Does it resonate? It's the creativity element that cuts through the clutter, and that means not only having your messaging sharp but also delivering that messaging in a creative and engaging way.

Steve Rotterdam: Creativity is the reason we exist. I once had a conversation with a client who was talking to me about fees. The context of the conversation was that we were looking for innovative ways, new ways in which to respond to some serious financial pressures that the client was under. I half jokingly said to her, "Well we can always deliver less creative product," looking for a laugh. She looked me straight in the eye, and in dead seriousness said, "No, you can't. Your people don't know how to be less creative."

"Our ability to be creative really is key to whether we live or die." LEWIS GOLDSTEIN, SNAPPLE

I took that not only as an incredible compliment, but also as incredible insight into the nature of what we have been trying to build. It's not that we're one of the most technologically advanced agencies on earth, or that we have very cool and nicely designed business cards, catchy slogans, a great PR agency or very, very overly glib officers. It's that creativity is marshaled with -- and in a service of, brands -- creative brand advocacy. That's what we attempt to do, even on the most minute, seemingly run-of-the-mill projects.

If you had to make a choice between building a database to reach your consumers and brainstorming a new, creative, mass media campaign to inspire them, which would you pick and why?

Goldstein: I'd pick the mass media campaign initially, with the database to support it. The mass media campaign allows us to set our strategy and set our tone and manner for who we are. And then if we do it right, the database marketing should follow up with specific information that's relevant to the consumers. But I believe we have to reach them first in a wider way, through mass marketing, and then target them.

Blunt: This is a left-brain versus right-brain question. One could argue this from the perspective of "attitudinal" versus "behavioral" marketing. I would look at "behavioral" as being on the database side and "attitudinal" as being on the mass media campaign side.

It's on the mass media campaign side that I create awareness of my brand, of my campaign, of my message. My database, meanwhile, is pivotal in attempting to influence consumers in a very direct way, and to understand who those consumers are and what their interests and preferences are, so that I can better target the message to specific constituencies.

So, you're killing me on this one! Given the choice of the two, we went with mass media for this calendar year and we're pursuing databases in this coming year. But it's hard to choose between the two because both are so pivotal. If I had to choose from a brand perspective, I might go for the mass media. But the disciplined marketer in me, who is accountable for effecting change in a one-to-one type environment, I would have to go with the databases.

Rotterdam: The short answer is brainstorming something that will inspire people. That creativity can employ and encompass a host of creative tools. We encourage our people to always look not just at the envelope, but all around the envelope. Search every inch of it, look inside of it, look behind it. What is there that is outside of the envelope? How will the recipient look at it? It's what keeps creative fresh, keeps you from becoming the dreaded H-word in our end of the business (which is, "Hack").

But the database can also be a valuable tool and even more than a tool. A tool, in and of itself can inspire and lead to certain things. So if I didn't have access to that database -- if I didn't know it was part of my toolbox -- my thinking might not flow into an area in which an appropriate, different, creative, compelling idea has come about that utilizes a database.

Finke: Depending on the objective, if you were driven to use a database, you still need outstanding creative to connect and inspire consumers. Typically at Nike, we lean towards the creative side and I think even when we choose to do tactical direct things like database marketing, we're still placing a very heavy burden on the creative.

Connecting to the consumer piece is obviously important. Good creative is based on insight. If you're just doing creative for creative sake that isn't relevant, then it's not going to inspire someone -- it's not going to take him or her to a new place.

Typically, Nike's mode has been built more on actually gaining those insights by connecting directly with consumers. Really going out and talking to them -- talking to athletes, experiencing things more directly to gather insights, as opposed to peer data kind of analysis. It is the foundation for creative.

Do new media give rise to new creative approaches, and if so, how?

Finke: Absolutely. It is a very exciting time for the world of digital marketing, which is what I'm in. We're seeing a shift from where the World Wide Web has been over the last four or five years -- from a page metaphor medium to truly the possibility for interactive experience. A lot of the new, rich-media tools are now enabling brands and companies to deliver experiences via the Web without going through page-by-page. We now actually have dynamic information presented in a truly creative interface. Bringing video and interaction into a single interface with music and sound can tap into emotions the way that some other media cannot.

We're just starting to see some of that, and it's absolutely going to revolutionize the way that marketers use the digital medium to interact with consumers. Additionally, there are a lot of reasons that, with fragmentation of the marketplace and traditional media that companies like Nike need to look for new and creative ways to connect with consumers. New media -- whether it is digital or whether it is utilizing books, DVDs, or different kinds of media --are absolutely going to create new forms of communication and marketing, and really challenge companies like ours to come up with new, creative approaches to inspire consumers.

Rotterdam: Not necessarily. The way we look at it is, media are neutral. Media have no opinion, no agenda, and no point of view. You know television is television; it's an electronic imagery delivery system. Radio is an electronic radio wave distribution system. Magazine is a printed publication. The Internet is a communications device.

It's the skin you put on it that makes it take on a creative character. Sometimes that skin, or the depth to which you can go, and the areas you may not have been able to get into before, can take you places you haven't been before. But the question is always, what do you do when you get there?

The fact that you're there is not the issue. The issue is what you do when you're there. What can you take advantage of? Do you embrace all that is wonderful, and different, and beautiful, and interesting and provocative about where it is that you've gone? It's not going to just happen because you happen to be there. You have to open the door and get out of your room.

"Each new medium provides an opportunity to version the message." ROBIN BLUNT, MASTERCARD

Blunt: Each new medium provides an opportunity to vision the message. Take a mall strategy. If you go into a mall and you're trying to influence consumers with the billboarding capability that malls represent now, the way that I engage consumers creatively against a given campaign will be different in that environment than the way I would engage them out on the Web, or through direct mail.

When I'm trying to communicate a variety of elements in a particular call-to-action, each one of these media provides a rather unique way with which to version that creative message, based on how consumers engage that media. The trick, of course, is to try to add some synergy to the overall messaging. That way, all those CRM touch points have some resonance and some collective influence -- the person sees it here, and then sees it there, and then somewhere else.

Media provide such robust ways to vision your messaging. That really becomes the challenge, because sometimes people will dismiss some of the below-the-line messaging opportunities and the creative opportunity that those represent. Or, sometimes all the money goes into broadcast TV, because it gives the broadest reach, even though the consumer may be influenced more persuasively through some other media. Particularly when you've got objectives that require some layering in the message -- that's where new media becomes rich, fertile ground for creative application by agencies and marketers.

Goldstein: In the past year, we developed a big integrated program with Viacom. We were really one of the first to use their new Viacom Plus division. We integrated what we had done before --TV -- with radio and outdoor. For the first time, we made a major push on their online networks. So our promotion extended across traditional media, but we also had a strong, interactive approach to it. Where we did specific online advertising, the focus of the promotion was online based. Our consumers went online, for Snapple at least, and created their own TV spots, and ultimately we turned two consumer ideas into TV spots. But it was all online-focused, and our promotion for 2003 is online focused.

For our other brands, like Yoo-hoo, we've built an online community with chat rooms and other elements so that our consumers can really interact with the brand in a larger way than just going somewhere and visiting a site once every six months. This summer, we're creating a continuity program where consumers can send in caps for prizes. One of the key lower level prizes is going to allow the winners to download ring tones and download graphics for phones and stuff. We've made an investment in that technology to be able to fulfill it online; whereas in the past we may have only focused on standard things we could ship through the mail.

How does your organization encourage creativity?

Finke: Nike started as a company of runners that set out, talked to other runners, got insights, translated that into performance and innovation and delivered that to the marketplace. It's what we're still doing today. The culture of this place is heavily built on that kind of fundamental process -- get out, be a sponge, gain insight, translate that into innovation in everything you do.

We actually do have a maxim here that is, be a sponge. One of the things that every Nike employee is challenged to do is to learn -- to spend time talking to consumers, traveling to different places, gaining new experience and, as I said, learning and gaining insights.

It's amazing to watch some of the product designers and product developers go out to the marketplace and just sit down and start talking to athletes and gather insights. It's amazing to see that, season after season -- creative performance innovation in products that you didn't expect. That spreads throughout the whole company, regardless of whether it's product development or marketing communications. We're constantly trying to discover new things and come up with new innovations that will inspire and delight consumers.

Goldstein: One of the things we've recently done is remodel our whole floor here in White Plains. We've created a common area that is meant to be our consumer's world. We've added Nintendo game cubes. There are all the different magazines that our consumers read -- whether it's Thrasher, Rolling Stone, FHM, Maxim -- whatever it may be. All the walls are magnetized, so that people can rip out things they see in magazines or anything in popular culture and put it on the walls.

We also have hired a director of consumer insights over the past year, and that person's job is just to get a gauge on what our consumers are doing. Also, once a month, the whole marketing department, as a group, has a field trip. One day we all went into New York City. Groups of five went to different parts of the city and our goal was to go to different places. Some went to a thrift shop in the East Village, while others to a perfume bar in SoHo.

Our assignment was to come back at the end of the day with insights. What new products could you think of that would make sense after seeing the Diesel store in SoHo? Or what new products did you think of when you went to the ESPN Zone in Times Square? The next month we all went to different colleges around New York and Connecticut and again, thought about what else we might be doing. What would be a great idea that could come out of our trip to Yale? One idea from that trip was that we build branded refrigerators that we supply for students and on the front of them they say it's a Yoo-hoo refrigerator.

Blunt: There's a certain kind of entrepreneurial, enterprise empowerment at MasterCard, where each member of the team is regarded as a functional authority. So, in my area of responsibility, whether it is my area of promotions -- or sponsorship, Web or advertising, it's a matter of pursuing and defending solutions that are strategically grounded but effective and impactful to an end user.

"We actually have a maxim here that is, be a sponge." BRYAN FINKE, NIKE

In that empowerment zone, the organization provides the ability for anyone on the team to get smart, whether it's external course work or challenging agencies. There is a great deal of pride within MasterCard from the marketing perspective on our brand equity in this whole "Priceless" campaign. We're in a unique position, because we've got such a hugely successful campaign. The challenge is to pivot off of that to add the value out to the distribution channel.

Our constituents, our member banks, are always looking for rationale and innovative solutions. There's a bit of a Coke versus Pepsi relationship between Visa and us! There's a big constituency with our member banks. They're looking for creative ways to engage consumers and they look to us to do it. So our organization encourages creativity kind of by demand, not by default.

Rotterdam: From the onset, every employee is told that the core belief of the agency is that creativity is not something that comes in a bottle or that resides only in a select few people. We don't have creative gurus, we don't have key perfect creative, and we don't have an "idea boy." We believe if you weren't creative in some way, shape, or form, you wouldn't be working here. So we encourage creativity by assuming it exists and by instilling an attitude that everybody here is creative. We actually have a weekly "idea bar," which is not quite a brainstorming session. All of the participants throw out ideas or fragments of ideas -- initial impressions on particular topics or concepts that may or may not be directly related to a client assignment.

It does help to have schooled, experienced creative articulators in an organization -- people who are very comfortable in the role of not only idea creation but also in the role of mentor. They recognize that it's part of their job to nurture new talent and to tap into resources, to uncover hidden resources that the owner might not have even been aware that he or she is creative.

We see creativity as a journey, a pathway to more creativity. You know, an art director once said to me that she was reluctant to let go of material that she had developed because she felt that it had to pay for itself, that because she had spent time on it, she was obligated to make it worth something. I told her it was okay to let go of it -- to look upon that as part of the creative process, that it doesn't have to be the be all and end all. You don't have to eat every pea on the plate. That's our creative attitude.

Which brands today use creativity to greatest competitive advantage in their marketing programs, and why?

Blunt: The latest Coors creative is spot on against their youthful target market. Their move into the NFL sponsorship is a big, big money game that they have played brilliantly. I love their TV commercials. I am engaged with them. I'm engaged with their brand. I love the way that they're leveraging their sponsorship equity to get that message out. So, Bravo! In a very crowded category, they are pulling away.

I also like M&M's global promotion on the color competition. They were able to take a leading category brand and create a promotional initiative around it. Asking consumers to choose which color should be the next M&M speaks right to the parallel issue of promoting transactions. It was executed brilliantly, and globally. They've leveraged what is truly the essence of their brand equity.

Finke: Apple is a very interesting brand, and similar to us in the sense that it is built on creativity and innovation. Apple is taking consumer insights and turning that into something that people haven't seen before -- and delivering it with functional beauty.

It is a company that creates performance innovation and designs with purpose. Then they translate that into their marketing programs. Seeing what they've done with their direct retail spaces, what they've done with advertising, and even down to collateral communication over the years, make Apple a great example. Nike looks at a lot of the brands that have that same kind of process. When it's better built on innovation-- a Sony or a Philips, or a BMW product -- we are impressed with what they do in that space.

Other kinds of brands -- I'll call them brands -- that I think are good examples are in the movie world. Seeing what the film The Matrix is doing right now with their re-launch and how they're finding new ways to reach consumers and take the backdrop of the original Matrix and really connect people to it and immerse them in that story. A band like U2 also has reinvented itself many times but manages to be creative and stay connected to its consumer bases. They're using creative in a very connected way.

Goldstein: I think Yoo-hoo has brought a lot of excitement and energy to our organization. They have done some really creative and cool things that changed the brand. The brand has a lot of Americana -- it has that Yogi Bera and Mickey Mantle image. But the group that joined us from Austin Nichols -- Kristin Krumpe is the director -- has done a lot of cool stuff, like sponsoring skate boarders and going on the Warped concert tour.

"We encourage creativity by instilling an attitude that everybody here is creative." STEVE ROTTERDAM, EASTWEST CREATIVE

When they're at events they do things that are so different, like the Yoo-hoo cutlet. A Yoo-hoo cutlet is when you get doused in Yoo-hoo and then you go in a little kiddy pool of sand, roll around, and so then you're a Yoo-hoo cutlet. Last summer the Yoo-hoo Tour was a garbage truck. And for Snapple our tour last year was the Die Hard Snapple Tour. Instead of just going around sampling Snapple, we did it in the context of a traveling barbershop from the '80s. So while you were listening to Bon Jovi we were dying your hair purple, or kids could get Mohawks, so they could transform themselves for the day. So what we think we did was present our products in a way that is not just a product, it's more about we're sort of adding something to their lifestyle, or their day.

Rotterdam: One that comes to mind immediately is Volkswagen. It's a lot more than a car. Volkswagen is an attitude. Volkswagen is a mindset. Volkswagen has become increasingly a badge for youth. It's the feeling I get of the brand -- not just from their advertising, but from their promotions, what they tie in with, what they exploit. They're very heavily involved in music, fashion and film. When you go into the showroom you see and feel it -- the styling of their automobiles, the color palettes, the fabrics, and the attitude of most of their salespeople. Everything exudes this sort of fearlessness.

Starbucks also continues to assert itself. They're consistent, and yet they're not McDonalds. There's still a sense of handcrafted-ness to them. Starbucks has brought more people into the coffee arena, or into the hot drink arena. It's an example of a brand and a business that has not only brought in people from the category but has truly expanded the category.

I also like what they've done with their involvement with CARE, and with countries and communities that are economically dependent upon coffee crops. While it is relatively PC (to be honest, considering a large chunk of the PC population that hangs out at Starbucks), their support of human rights in countries and co-operatives, communities that support human rights, their taking a stand on it is very courageous. Yes, it's good business for them, but it's also very courageous. And that reflects back on the brand when you see the product at your local Albertsons, and it's not in a Starbucks environment. You can't ask for anything better than that.